[580] Tips for Interviewers and Interviewees

Jason [00:00:00]: You. This is the authentic persuasion show. Jason [00:00:06]: All right. Jason [00:00:06]: One of the biggest things that's happening right now, I mean, I guess it always happens, is that there's so many people out there trying to get jobs and then there's also companies trying to hire. So I thought I would make an episode about the interview process. And what I'm going to say here is going to apply to both sides. So if you're a candidate or someone that's thinking about changing jobs and you want to go interview for a job, then this is for you. If you're an interviewer, if you're trying to fill positions for salespeople or anybody, again, everything in life is sales. So you can apply this to any recruiting of any role for anything, truly, then this is also for you. Now, why would I make one episode and share it with both sides instead of keeping it secret? So the interviewees know this and the interview because it doesn't matter. And I want you to know the same thing. Jason [00:01:00]: I want to level the playing field because the biggest thing to remember interviewees is you're interviewing the company as much as they're interviewing you. Now, you've probably heard that before. This might not be new information, but it's very true. A lot of people have heard it, but they don't believe it. You are interviewing that company, that manager, that hiring manager, that CEO, as much as they're hiring you. You want to make sure it's a good fit. You are getting into a relationship with someone, the company, the people that work there. Like any relationship, you want to make sure it works. Jason [00:01:33]: You want to make sure you're going to be happy in it. Now, a lot of people don't look. Jason [00:01:37]: At it that way. Jason [00:01:37]: I'm going to work. I have my job and then I have my life and I have my relationships. And that's different. It's not. It's the same thing. And the reason why is for the same reason I talk about sales the way I do is it's h to h. It's human to human. It's all relationships. Jason [00:01:50]: It's all human interactions, and it's all one life. It's very hard, and I doubt it's possible long term to have your work personality and your work life and your after work personality and outside of work life and have it be separate. Jason [00:02:07]: Right. Jason [00:02:07]: There's not work Jason, and not work Jason. Jason [00:02:10]: Right. Jason [00:02:10]: I might be a little more intense. I might be a little more driven. I might focus on some things, but it's still me. The personality is the same now, some people try to do that. I put on my work face and I'm in worky business mode and I use worky business jargon and I talk about that and then when I'm done, I go into normal mode. I think some people try to do that. I don't think it's effective. I think it's probably not sustainable either. Jason [00:02:34]: If you can do it, it's great. But you're basically playing a part, you're acting in some part of your life. You're either pretending to play a part at work for 810, 12 hours a day or you're pretending to play a part in your personal life and your relationships because that's not who you are either and you can't sustain that long term. Jason [00:02:50]: Right? Jason [00:02:50]: Like you say, oh, well, that person plays this part on a movie. Yeah, they played on a movie for a couple of months and then they move on with their life and then they don't make another movie for quite some time. And so you are who you are. And the reason why I say that is because again, this is all relationships. The company, if you're doing the interviewing and recruiting, you're looking for someone who you want to have a relationship with that you want on your team that's going to be a good fit. Do they pick their clothes up every night and put it away or not? Yes, that's a personal reference, but are they going to be good in the break room or the lunchroom? Are they going to show up to your meetings on time? Are they going to be respectful or not? Does that matter to you or not? Are you the kind of person who shows up late? So might as well have everyone that shows up late, that's also okay. You just want to know what you're getting. So big thing, interviewees, when you're being interviewed for a job, remember you're interviewing them. Jason [00:03:41]: Look for signs that make you happy and align with you or not. And again, there's no right or wrong, there's no good or bad. It's not one size fits all. It's not. You better go find a company that does this and acts like this because that's no, everybody's different. So you might like a company that does X versus Y. What you want to look for that person interviewing you, especially if in their sales leadership role, which means they're directly over sales, is how do they act in the interview? Do they sit there the whole time and explain the company and do a long sales pitch on the company? Do they push really hard about the exciting opportunities, how much money you're going to make. Are they trying to hype you up and are they trying to sell you the position? Are they trying to sell you the position and the company and the comp plan and all of the great things and all of the cool stuff? What's going to happen is if that's the case, if you go to work for them, they're going to expect you to do that as a sales role. Jason [00:04:42]: In your sales mode. It's going to be the same thing. Selling, selling, selling. High pressure, high excitement, high charisma, high benefits. Like, here's the big shiny thing. Here's all the value from buying our product or service. That's what they're going to expect. And the reason why I can say that is if you try to do a consultative sale, it's not going to fit their model. Jason [00:05:04]: Managers aren't going to be happy. They're not going to give you good feedback. You're not going to fit in with that mode. It's not going to be successful. Now, if you have an interviewer who's asking you lots of questions, they explain some of the company benefits. They explain the company, but they ask you questions. They want to know about you. They want to find out about you. Jason [00:05:23]: They really want to know if this is a good fit. And they want to understand that before they move forward. That's going to be the same way they're going to expect you to sell because that's going to be the way they built their sales process, is around selling from a place of a consultative sale, finding out about the customers. Is it a good fit? How could I help you? And then here's what I think we should do. For example, when I sit down and I interview someone, I barely look at the resume and I barely explain the company, whatever company I'm hiring for. And I just want to know about the other person. I want to know about you, the interviewee, and I want to see if it's a good fit. It doesn't do any good for me to explain all about the company, the comp plan, the benefits, the insurance, the time off, and blah, blah, blah. Jason [00:06:07]: If it's not a good fit and you're not going to be a good fit, you're not going to be happy, and I'm not going to be happy, and I don't want you to work there. Let's save some time. That's also my sales mode. Jason [00:06:16]: Right. Jason [00:06:17]: I don't spend the first 20 minutes of a 30 minutes meeting talking about myself to hype myself up and get you excited. I don't care about me. I want to know about you and see if I can help you, and then I'll explain about me. Jason [00:06:28]: Right. Jason [00:06:28]: That's how I built my process. So you want to look out for that. And again, there's no right, wrong, good or bad. It's just, does this align with you? Do you like selling hype and charisma and benefits and all that cool stuff? And are you excited about all of the things that come with that kind of mode? Jason [00:06:46]: Great. Jason [00:06:46]: Perfect fit. Welcome aboard. Jason [00:06:48]: Right? Jason [00:06:49]: Like, go with it. If that's not your mode, then take that as a sign. That's probably not a good fit. Does the interviewer show up on time? Are they professional? Do they take your time seriously? Do they respond quickly? Do they ghost you or not? Do you have to make lots of follow ups? That's going to be the way they run as a manager as well and as a company, as a company culture. And that goes for HR as well, because it always comes from the top down, right? CEO, founder, president comes from the top down. And that company culture stems from their view on things. And so it's going to affect everybody. All right, now, on the flip side, interviewers, you just heard me talk about that for their side, I'm directly talking to you now. Jason [00:07:34]: And it's true if you're like, oh, I interview like this, but this, no, it's always congruent. I've never seen someone interview one way where they have this approach on an interview and then have a different sales process. It's always the same. It's got to be the same because the company culture is going to be in alignment with how it views people. Jason [00:07:58]: Right? Jason [00:07:58]: Whether you're selling to customers or you're selling to employees, how you treat employees versus how you treat customers, it's always in alignment. So from your side, obviously, look at that with your own process and then with the people that you're interviewing. This is one of the biggest things I see still so much focus in the recruiting process on the standard classic. I'm trying to be nice, but the classic questions, right? Tell me about a time when you lost a big sale and how did you recover and how did it make you feel? Tell me about your best quarter. You did. Tell me about how you manage your follow ups. Tell me about the worst manager you ever worked for. Tell me about the best manager you ever worked for. Jason [00:08:35]: Blah, blah, blah. Those are good insights if you know what you're actually listening for. But so many people in the interview process, just download a list of questions, go through the motions, because that's what they think they should do. And then they just hire who they want or they're looking for experience. Here's what I'll tell you, is I don't ask any of those questions. I don't care about any of those things. And the reason why is if somebody's trying to get a sales position and they have some sales experience, they're going to go in sales mode like everyone is, because again, everything in life is sales. And in an interview they're selling you on why they're a good candidate. Jason [00:09:08]: So they're going to put a positive spin on it. Tell me about a big deal you lost. Oh, it was this, but it wasn't that bad. And I recovered well and I was happy and it was okay. Jason [00:09:16]: Right? Jason [00:09:16]: They could have been depressed for a long time. It could have been miserable. It could have led to like, a divorce. You don't know. But they're not going to tell you that, right? They're going to spin it, they're going to sell it. So when you're interviewing salespeople, be careful, especially about canned questions that everyone can prepare for and be ready. You're just wasting everyone's time. It's just ridiculous. Jason [00:09:35]: Please stop doing that. And I don't. I want to know about them. I want to know about their experiences. I don't want to know what they're looking for next. What is it they're hoping to find? If they've been working for a while, right, a while is relative, but it's like, hey, you've done all these things. What is it you want to do? Where do you want to do with your life? What do you find that you like the most? What would you like to do? What do you not want to do? Again, I want to know you as a person. I want to know what makes you tick. Jason [00:10:02]: And then, because I am who I am, it's the same thing in the sales process. I'm going to listen really closely. I'm going to pay close attention to what they say, how they say and what their answers are, and then see if it's an intersection with it. Jason [00:10:14]: Right. Jason [00:10:14]: There's no right or wrong. I'm just looking for someone who's going to be a good fit. How does that work in the process? The other big thing that I do is I pretty much always start with, and I mentioned this before, is I just ask questions. I ask them whatever questions they have. So tell me, like, here's what we do. You probably researched it. What questions do you have for us? What questions do you have for me? I'll ask them, too. I'll say, hey, prior to this first meeting, tell me about what you found out about our company. Jason [00:10:42]: Tell you about what we do. Tell me about what we do and what we sell. And if they're like, well, I submitted a lot of applications and I've applied to a lot of jobs, so I don't really know what you guys do. So why don't you tell me we're done. I will answer their question and then we're done. Jason [00:10:58]: Right? Jason [00:11:00]: Because if they didn't care enough to do research for that, come on, what are they going to do in the sales role when you put them in that seat? How seriously are you going to take it? How seriously are they going to take your leads? They're not, I promise you. And then I want to know how much research they did. They don't have to know what we do because then we wouldn't need to train them. But I want to know did they care and then what questions they have. And then those questions will tell me a lot. Are they insightful questions? Do they want to know about industry, the challenges, what it takes to be successful? Do they want to know about vacation time and hours of work and flexibility? Because then that tells me that's what they care about most and that's not going to make me happy as their boss in the company. Or do they say, no, I don't have any questions, I'm good. When can I start? I promise you, that's what they're going to do all up in your sales pipeline. Jason [00:11:50]: They are not going to ask questions. They are not going to care, and they are just going to assume they can show up and be successful. And that's not how life works. That's not how sales work. So hopefully that helps you. Now, why would I do this combined episode again for both of you, interviewees and interviewers, if you made it this far? Well, if you're an interviewee, if you're a candidate, I want you to know what good companies should be looking for. And I don't want you to pretend and be like, I did all this research so I can pretend like I care about you and I have all these insightful questions. No, I want you to figure out is that you do you do research, do you care? And if so, you want a company that is asking you those things and actually cares about you. Jason [00:12:26]: If you don't want to research and you don't care and you don't have any questions, that's fine. Find a company that doesn't care. If you care, they just going to play the numbers game and they're going to send you out there knocking on doors trying to set appointments for something or selling something and they literally don't care. And that's going to be a good fit. Again, there's no good bad right or wrong. The key is you want it to be a good fit. If you're expecting consultative and they want hard hitting, pushy, high pressure sales, it's never going to work. Jason [00:12:57]: Right? Jason [00:12:57]: It's not one is better than the other. It's what's a good fit for you. Jason [00:13:01]: Right? Jason [00:13:02]: Like if you're dating somebody, they want to get married and have kids someday. You never want to get married and you never want to have kids. I promise you somebody's going to have to change their mind. And I promise you that usually doesn't go well. And so you want to make sure you enter into a good relationship that matches and you have the same goals in the same mode. Same happens with sales. So hopefully this helps you no matter what side you're on. If you want help with your recruiting process, if you're a company manager leader listening to this and you want to build an effective recruiting process, please reach out to me. Jason [00:13:34]: You can email me. [email protected] you can go find out more information and how to reach me on Cutterconsultinggroup.com on the website. This is what I do is I build scalable recruiting and interview processes to help you find the best candidates to fit your culture, your sales mode and what you're focused on doing and selling and how you want to go about it. So please let me know if I can help you in any way. And thank you everybody for being here. No matter what side of the table you're on in the interview process or what side of the Zoom call you're on, I appreciate it. Hopefully this helps you in some way. And thank you for helping fill the world with authentic persuaders.